About a wk or so ago I decided to write down how many times I would KD a guy and he would get up in a fight. If I never knocked him down i didn't count it (i.e if I sub him w/o a KD, I never recorded anything about that fight). I wanted to see how often Regular Fighters would get up as compared to CAFs, because I've always had the feeling that CAFs, pretty much regardless of what 'style' they are (brawler, jiu jitsu, etc.), seem to get up easier/more often than regular fighters. What I found:
The 20 Regular Fighters: Got up an average of 1.2 times per Fight
The 20 CAF Fighters: Got up an average of 1.7 times per Fight
Now I doubt this is highly statistically significant (pretty much I need to record like at least 100 of each type of fighter to be sure of the results), I think it fits into what I felt like was going on.
Conclusions?
* It's easier to get up as a CAF no matter what the health ratings are? (Maybe)
* People who play as CAFs are 'better' at getting up (Doubt it)
* It's ridiculously easy to get a very high Health rating for every style of CAF, and Boxer/Brawlers have extreme get-up abilities that are way better than the 'regular fighter' group (Probably)
I'm not sure what the 'Max' Health stats are on the different CAF styles or how they compare to the Regular guys...maybe I'll look into that. I'll admit it seems like Fedor's get up about as often as CAFs....but that's really the only fighter who compares. Maybe I'm crazy but I swear, CAFs are almost guaranteed to get up from the TKO game twice. And yea you need to get on him quickly and it depends on how much you've worn him down throughout the fight...so I guess this isn't 100% scientific or anything but I think it shows yet another piece of evidence that CAFs may just be OP compared to regular fighters (except Fedor, altho I think CAFs can still be OP compared to Fedor just not by that much). Comments? :)
Viva La Revolution !
|||It will be interesting to see what if any changes EA makes after their data mining and if they jive with you personal experiences. :)|||I will volunteer to run some analysis for them lol I just got my M.S. in Finance from Purdue and I have nothing better to do all day but look for a job and play MMA lol Give me the data and I'll run all types of tests on it and write a huge report for the forums on what I find haha it'll let me brush up on some of my skills....oh man, if I could find a job then maybe I wouldn't be ranked #5 in the world :)|||
It will be interesting to see what if any changes EA makes after their data mining and if they jive with you personal experiences. :)
having worked as a game developer myself, it becomes more and more clear that you have no idea what youre talking about|||Also factor in the chance that people using cafs may be more competitive than someone using ingame fighters. Now im not saying anyone using ingame fighters is not competitive but im saying there is a higher chance that person is more of a casual gamer.
and Verbal--Kint....you need to be a little less of a DBAG sir.|||they working on a patch to fix the caf glitch|||
Also factor in the chance that people using cafs may be more competitive than someone using ingame fighters. Now im not saying anyone using ingame fighters is not competitive but im saying there is a higher chance that person is more of a casual gamer.
and Verbal--Kint....you need to be a little less of a DBAG sir.
You think that enough to type it?
A person who uses roster fighters mainly is likely to be a casual? That seems like a big leap of assumption outside of the basic idea that yea, its faster to pick a guy then sit and make one. But casual or hardcore, most people will make their hero/comedy/parody/reality character in these games cause its just what people do. Some guys wanna knock people out with eddie murphy. Cool beans.
Has absolutely nothing to do with player skill in the game. If anything the cafs take more away from skill because ding ding ding, you max the stats of the abilities your use alot. Max power/max this max that etc. The stats are what seperate the player input skill from the assumed character skill i.e classic bas rutten is usually god in most hands because his stats. I find it hard to believe players running around with the typical standup weak sub caf are all a product of skill and the few guys that can beat me with sub par roster fighters when im using mid/high roster fighters are less skilled.
When you start beating people with weaker roster characters, you can talk about skill. General fighting game rule of thumb is that if you can do well with the characters WITHOUT the statistical advantages, then maybe you are winning more with your mind and thoughts and less with the fact that your dude hits hard as hell and you got the takedown stuffs on lock.|||the key word i used is "may" so i wasnt saying it as a fact i was just bringing it up as something to possibly factor in. Not everyone playing this game is a die hard gamer that cries when they lose and feels the need to send a nasty msg to everyone they fight.
I got the game 2 weeks ago and just started using cafs 4 days ago. i switched cause i play in a league that uses them and i figured why use a fighter that has stats that do not match my style of play. if i love the submission game and i love jits then why make a fighter with any high rated standup at all. same with the ground i never ever go for a sub then why should my fighter have any sub stats at all? in my eyes he shouldnt, same goes for clinch if i never use it why waste stats in clinch strike power or speed, its a waste. Everyone seems to be complaing about guys with high rated standup, are you all going to complain if people start maxing ground and takedowns and subs?|||
the key word i used is "may" so i wasnt saying it as a fact i was just bringing it up as something to possibly factor in. Not everyone playing this game is a die hard gamer that cries when they lose and feels the need to send a nasty msg to everyone they fight.
I got the game 2 weeks ago and just started using cafs 4 days ago. i switched cause i play in a league that uses them and i figured why use a fighter that has stats that do not match my style of play. if i love the submission game and i love jits then why make a fighter with any high rated standup at all. same with the ground i never ever go for a sub then why should my fighter have any sub stats at all? in my eyes he shouldnt, same goes for clinch if i never use it why waste stats in clinch strike power or speed, its a waste. Everyone seems to be complaing about guys with high rated standup, are you all going to complain if people start maxing ground and takedowns and subs?
I meant no hostility in the last post so forgive me if reads that way. My interest is purely in logic and balance on a basic level.
Dont know much about crying or sending messages to people ( Since this game launched my message inbox is FULL of everything from "omg that was amazing fight" to questions about my sexual orientation and the origin of my mother.
To address your valid points, and cause your a bit new as you say I'll say this. When the game launched most people were using the stick. It was evident online just by the punching game alone. More so, alot of people did exactly what you said at the end their, they had "ground wizard" cafs and jacares etc. Full takedown, fullsubs, full pass etc. It was pretty scary too the first couple weeks. I used to actually fear me an aoki.
Then we all learned the game. The classic control craze sweep began and the hook/teep/body kick quantities (mainly hooks) sky rocketed. Not only this but the classic users who faired well with hooks and takedown stuffs finally started getting the hang of the actual ground game (takes longer but in the end is just as effective as the stick once you got the memory. All this compounded to crush pure ground/sub fighters. The only choke they had that could be applied quickly is the triangle. Every single other sub can be denied very easily at that level of play and only with strong stamina depletion were you subbing anyone with anything that wasn't a triangle. People stopped making/using them because they became ineffective versus experienced players.
Everyone essentially migrated to the winning formula and that was classic controls and standup cafs. Thats why people on the board whine and complain. All games like this will filter down into thier respective online "meta games" and this game has a few good types of meta game that can appear unbalanced but have balance (such as the triangle though their is room for debate why other subs aren't as risky) but the current meta game with the classic striking +/cookie cutter caf archtype/glitches just seems like a dead end in that department.|||I see what your saying it all makes sense.
Im going to make a comparison to UFC undisputed 2010. in that game they did make improvements but i think those improvements were also their downfall. They made instant takedowns in order to simulate how a person can be taken down IRL when they are striking. now in real life it is the choice to go for a takedown and factors come into play that will deter you from doing so or influence you to do so. In the game UFC 2010 there was not much reason to not go for the takedown or to clinch and spend the whole fight doing so when the other person tries to strike standing. Everyone complained that the fights all turned into clinchfests and lay and pray battles, but in real life we see that on almost every fight card at least 1 fight. look at peen vs Florian they spent the entire fight up against the cage in a clinch. why? cause Florian made the choice to put the fight there (outcome of the fight is not the point here). When UFC put the ability to have that freedom in their game it backfired on them. so going more sim isnt always good.
sure you could have a standup battle but everyone's paranoia and desire to win led them to go for takedowns and clinch constantly. thus ruining the game essentially.
So in my opinion they made the game more like real life but they cannot control the users actions or decisions. I do not think it is possible to have a videogame that replicates real life in a true sim fashion without having the chessy side of things. the only way to prevent people from using the cheese would be to remove their freedom thus not making it a sim experience.
Leagues attempt to do this while giving the user some freedom still, this is why they have stat caps. On ranked play there will never be a way to have 100% fairness cause there are always a % of people that will resort to the cheap cheesy play styles to win.|||I was watching one of the mystic fight cards and the fight between Ve jrod vs XzEXECUTIONERxZ was weird. vE jrod got rocked 5 times by X in the 4 rounds i watched and Ve jrod got up all 5 times. Thats a little weird since i've pnly seen and managed to get up 3 time MAX.........just saying there needs to be a limited a guy can put on stats, so he cant have 100 on stuff like striking, defense, and grappling. Maybe a 93 a limit or something|||
It will be interesting to see what if any changes EA makes after their data mining and if they jive with you personal experiences. :)
having worked as a game developer myself, it becomes more and more clear that you have no idea what youre talking about
Well its all good and nice that you worked as a game developer, but WTF does that have to do with what I said. EA does use data mined information to help make changes to their games so I really don't understand what specific issue you have with me repeating that fact.
Hard as it may be for you, lets try to stay on topic and chuck that personal stuff please.|||
I was watching one of the mystic fight cards and the fight between Ve jrod vs XzEXECUTIONERxZ was weird. vE jrod got rocked 5 times by X in the 4 rounds i watched and Ve jrod got up all 5 times. Thats a little weird since i've pnly seen and managed to get up 3 time MAX.........just saying there needs to be a limited a guy can put on stats, so he cant have 100 on stuff like striking, defense, and grappling. Maybe a 93 a limit or something
There are limits on all the stats based on the style.
I don't really think the CAFs are that overpowered. I would rather fight a CAF then Fedor. Any CAF that is really strong in one area is going to be really weak in another. Fedor doesn't have any weaknesses.
I wouldn't mind seeing more limitations on the CAF's but I'd also like to see the roster fighters be more balanced.|||Any CAF > Fedor, Clas Bas|||
Any CAF > Fedor, Clas Bas
I remember when people were complaining it was the other way around before a bunch of people got the right CAF builds to lay down the law properly. :)
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